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| Ladder Discussion Everything related to altitudeladder.com and the ladder servers goes here. |
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#1
11-07-2010, 01:19 AM
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Smurfing in ladder
Do we even need to talk about why this is retarded and should be banned.
Edit: let me make at least one point so my post isn't completely void of content. Ball'n argues that his 2nd name (balln goes pew pew) is correctly rated since hes played a fair amount of games on it by now. but thats his "im not trying" name and so its rated 800-900 points below his other name.... but its not fair because he plays on that name when hes drunk/tired/high and sometimes does play "bad", so that keeps his rating in check. but say he's playing against me, or matt, or someone who is threatening his ladder position... well obviously this gives him the oppurtunity to play us with a free 900 points and keep OUR ratings in check. Because even if i played fantastically, and played 600 points above my current rating, teams would still be unbalanced in balln's favor if he were to try to keep me from winning and just play "regular". Which is exactly what happened today. Another obvious issue is that to have even gotten his 2nd name to its "accurate" rating, he has essentially robbed the rest of the ladder of 5 or 600 points. the ladder is a zero sum game -- to move up in rating, you must steal points from the other team. Having multiple instances of the same player helps to destroy the accuracy and shrinks the overall range of ladder ratings Last edited by zz-; 11-07-2010 at 01:28 AM. 
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#4
11-07-2010, 01:33 AM
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#6
11-07-2010, 02:06 AM
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not true. i have always cared and think it is obviously wrong and stupid. nobody can argue the fact that it creates unfair games. just ban the known smurf accounts from the ladder servers. nobody suffers at all from this move, and the world becomes a better place.
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#7
11-07-2010, 02:09 AM
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I agree, but the admins don't seem to care enough to ban it. Actually, I think the issue is that they don't want to sort through all the accounts in an attempt to find smurfs instead of simply not caring.
... But you gotta admit the gif is awesome.
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#8
11-07-2010, 02:35 AM
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It did bring a certain je ne sais quois to the thread.
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#9
11-07-2010, 06:16 AM
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We've discussed it and there's a high probability smurf accounts will be banned for ladder season 2 if not earlier.
Also, I'm not 100% clear on the intricacies of the new rating system, but last I heard it will not be zero-sum, and may have additional features that discourage smurfing. Nobo knows more than me, but he refuses to tell me anything useful.
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#10
11-07-2010, 06:42 AM
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#11
11-07-2010, 11:13 AM
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Kuja, several things wrong with that.
#1, you're saying its only unfair until your rating gets accurate. That's not a great defense for smurfing, saying it only ruins a few DOZEN games. Per person who is doing it. #2, because of exactly what happened yesterday. Balln out of nowhere plays at his full capacity (on his smurf name) in games where he wants to win and can ruin any game he wants to at any time. http://www.altitudeladder.net/match....&mode=ball_6v6 Look at those teams. Balln, whether he admits it or not, tries much harder in games against me. Theres no way our team could possibly win that game with balln playing at full (2800ish) capacity with a free 900 rating points on his team. He ended that game with like 4 goals or so, and had a part in all 6. The game ended 6-4. Anyway, i'm surprised any of you are trying to defend what would obviously be banned in any game with REAL competition. Just because altitude is a small game with most things being player-run doesn't mean you should do everything you can get away with. In the long run it just ruins competition and drives players who are more into other games (like me) away.
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#16
11-07-2010, 04:22 PM
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Anyway, on the general subject, Zz has pretty much said it all. It's a clear intent to ruin at will the competition and while I couldn't care less about the rating per se, it severely hinders the teams balancing the system is trying to achieve. The only problem in making it a basic rule is the possible elusiveness of the smurfing which can make the hunting tricky. But it doesn't mean it shouldn't be dealt with when clear cases present themselves. Last edited by Sunaku; 11-07-2010 at 10:18 PM. Reason: spelling
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#17
11-07-2010, 07:18 PM
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Well let's break it down like this.
Pro's of smurfing: -The people smurfing get their e-peen a little harder having 2 names in the top 50 instead of just one -The people smurfing can relax a little? -Karl and Lamster potentially make more $? Con's of smurfing: -Negatively effects balance of games until the proper rating is reached. (absolutely undeniable) -Players on smurfs can potentially play worse or better to affect ratings of others without really affecting their own rating. (absolutely undeniable that it could potentially happen) -People cannot see how they truly stand in the ladder. They aren't the 49th best player like it says, they are the 47th with two retarded smurfs chillin above them. -They keep their rating at the level they were playing instead of the level they are playing. Player might be on a slump but their real account won't feel a thing. -I'm sure there are others. As we can all see, there is no real reason to NOT permaban them, and a few reasons to do so. I'm not saying ban kuja or {ball}'n, i'm only saying ban viborg and pew pew (and others im sure people know about)
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#18
11-07-2010, 10:20 PM
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Don't see a problem in smurfing, why shouldn't people be able to play on whatever account they choose? Just treat the player as he just started playing ladder. Sure it's gonna imbalance teams for some time, but thats how climbing in ladder is done. One team is always imbalanced.
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#22
11-08-2010, 01:17 AM
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#23
11-08-2010, 01:18 AM
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#32
11-08-2010, 02:58 PM
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On a side note, banning smurfs from ladder is one step from banning people using multiple perks/planes. I mean lets take Sin as an example, a pro trickster who is mediocre to bad at everything else. Him picking any other setup is going to misrepresent his ranking just as someone smurfing. Fascist advent? DUM DUM DUM
V I hate that movie.
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#33
11-08-2010, 03:47 PM
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I think part of this issue could potentially be solved by having ladder rankings change over time. I don't know how many of you played World of Warcraft - but the system in there was that you had to play at least 10 games a week to get credit for it. In other words, if someone gets to their top spot and then leaves - they would be removed from the rankings until they played 10 games again. This is to prevent people from getting a great number of points and clouding up space.
Note: Let's say Kuja is at 2500 and decides not to play for a week. When he comes back his rating will still be at 2500. He just won't be listed in the actual rankings until 10 games a week have been played (or we could do like 5 games a week if people think 10 is too much).
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#35
11-08-2010, 04:09 PM
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#36
11-08-2010, 04:17 PM
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Main issue with smurfs is the ability to throw games. Which is against Ladder rules. So if someone is using a smurf account and they throw a game and we know who it is, both should be banned. If they're doing it for a different set up/ take others ranks down, it will be obvious, because they're trying. Otherwise I don't really see an issue with handing out bans to multiple accounts to hit the user in question.
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#37
11-08-2010, 04:47 PM
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#38
11-08-2010, 04:53 PM
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#39
11-08-2010, 05:21 PM
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So technically if i wanted to get an account where i just played laser and didnt have to cycle through every plane as my team needs i could do it? Without throwing games, just to see how the rating would be if I only played 1 plane instead of adapting, or do you have to keep the same playstyle also on the smurf.
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#40
11-08-2010, 05:41 PM
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This is a stupid discussion.
Use common sense people. Ladder exists so people can have a competitive outlet other than Sundays during leagues. If your actions deliberately detract from the overall ladder experience, then what you do is in effect, bannable. Quit trying to find scummy ways to get around the rules just so you can get a leg up or for some added internet attention. Don't use smurfs to rig games. Don't use smurfs to screw up balance. It's not that hard.
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