tbd_Shard

[Jayfourke]

So I thought I'd try my hand at making a map. Started off basic, but I assume I can add backgrounds and textures later, or someone more artistic could, at least.

I've been pretty nasty with this, angling the base against the typical lobshots that I myself love to play. To compensate, there are 4 entrances to the base. I went for team-bomb, which everyone seems to prefer. So yeah, get playing!

EDIT: version 2



Downloadable version is http://rapidshare.com/files/429875256/tbd_shard2.altx

Comments and criticism welcomed, and anyone who wishes to host this on their server is free to do so.

[innerlyte]

Nice to see different community members getting into map making

Just a quick tip before I DL --
Generally, map makers don't create collidable objects from within the editor (as lamsbro explains in the map editor guide). Drawing with the poly tool can be a little crude and cumbersome. What most people do is create objects within a third party image editing program (Photoshop, Gimp, Illustrator, etc.) and then import them into the map editor. Even if you aren't planning on doing the art yourself, it will allow you greater flexibility to do it this way. I'm not sure how comfortable you are with something like Photoshop, but if you use it, make sure you save objects with transparent backgrounds and as PNG files. Then, drop the files into the map editor's "images" folder for that map (e.g. C:\Program Files\Altitude\editor\maps\tbd_shard\images). Make sure you refresh your resources after placing the images there (Edit > Refresh Resources). Then, you can bring up the "Show Create Geom" window (from the "Window" menu) and drag and drop your objects from there.

Another thing you can do is draw the entire map in Photoshop (leaving the background transparent), and then, from within the editor, go to Map > Import Large PNG. The editor will import the map to the stage and auto-detect all of the edges for you.

Anyway, the map looks pretty good at first sight. Will have to let you know how it plays XD

[Jayfourke]

But... it works by doing polys in the map editor, right? To be honest, I found it quite easy. I just did up to roughly halfway, and then copy-paste-inverted to get the other side. Then all I had to do was switch turret, spawn and base teams, do some little adjustments, and voila.

I have photoshop and can use it, so I guess I could give the method above a go. (For the record, I read about half of lamsbro's guide before getting confused and just fudging my way into the program.)

Any more comments?

[mikesol]

When I click the download link it says I shouldn't be there and asks if I want to log in. Is it just me or can anyone else download it?

[wolf'j'max]

meh can't dl it either, jake just use rapidshare or something easy =]

[innerlyte]

Originally Posted by Jayfourke

But... it works by doing polys in the map editor, right?

Yeah, that way works fine. You just end up with more angular objects than you would if you freehanded them in Photoshop.

[Jayfourke]

OK, new link. This should work, I hope. http://rapidshare.com/files/429853331/tbd_Shard1.alte

[mikesol]

Originally Posted by Jayfourke

OK, new link. This should work, I hope. http://rapidshare.com/files/429853331/tbd_Shard1.alte

That's just an xml file - not a map file lol.

[Jayfourke]

Damn this complexity. What do I do to make this bloody map work?

[mikesol]

Originally Posted by Jayfourke

Damn this complexity. What do I do to make this bloody map work?

If you e-mail it to me I can host the map for you. My e-mail is mikesol@gmail.com - and I'll post a link here for people to download it

[Jayfourke]

Sent, thanks.

EDIT: found the export function, and the correct directory location. http://rapidshare.com/files/429862376/tbd_shard1.altx should work.

[mikesol]

K it's hosted on the prose only server. People have tested it yet but here's my initial thoughts:

1) The map is too small in width. You can fly from one base to the other very very quickly.

2) You can lob the bomb from half way in the map which is kind of a bummer considering the map is so small. This lob can occur at pretty much any of the heights mid to up. Bombing in general is far too easy.

3) There should be a top turret because presently the top path is too easy to get by.

4) The objects are too sharp. I think there should be some smoothness to them. Also the graphs could use some updating but I realize that concern is less pressing than making a balanced map.

5) The triangle on top of the base should be bigger.

I'll post more thoughts after further testing.

[Jayfourke]

OK, taken points 1-3,5 into account and rejigged the map thus. 1000px wider, more turrets, and base is more protected.

Yeah, it seems like a lot of turrets, but they all cover different angles.



Downloadable version is http://rapidshare.com/files/429875256/tbd_shard2.altx

Let me know what you think!

[Mandrad]

Havent played it yet but here's my tip; small objects above the base block too much bombs and are nothing but a crash party - this will be anoying!
Other than that, it looks good.

N1

[classicallad]

Originally Posted by innerlyte

Nice to see different community members getting into map making

Just a quick tip before I DL --
Generally, map makers don't create collidable objects from within the editor (as lamsbro explains in the map editor guide). Drawing with the poly tool can be a little crude and cumbersome. What most people do is create objects within a third party image editing program (Photoshop, Gimp, Illustrator, etc.) and then import them into the map editor. Even if you aren't planning on doing the art yourself, it will allow you greater flexibility to do it this way. I'm not sure how comfortable you are with something like Photoshop, but if you use it, make sure you save objects with transparent backgrounds and as PNG files. Then, drop the files into the map editor's "images" folder for that map (e.g. C:\Program Files\Altitude\editor\maps\tbd_shard\images). Make sure you refresh your resources after placing the images there (Edit > Refresh Resources). Then, you can bring up the "Show Create Geom" window (from the "Window" menu) and drag and drop your objects from there.

Another thing you can do is draw the entire map in Photoshop (leaving the background transparent), and then, from within the editor, go to Map > Import Large PNG. The editor will import the map to the stage and auto-detect all of the edges for you.

Anyway, the map looks pretty good at first sight. Will have to let you know how it plays XD

I reckon 'Blender' would be a cool program to use, i know its predominatly 3D based but the 2D detail is great, and its free!

[mikesol]

Suggestions

1) Change the background color. It hurts the eyes right now. Darken the objects. I know it's not skinned but it hurts to play.

2) The objects are too angular. Perfect for randas - sucky for other people

3) Turrets need to be spaced out more.

4) The map is too big

5) The layout needs some revising but I don't know what to say specifically

[silent skies]

At a glance:

- looks like the spawns are way too far away from the base.

- Also, looks like it's very possible to get a long lob from around the top-middle of the map, though without testing it I wouldn't know for sure.

- You probably want to reduce the powerups from 6 to 4... speaking from personal experience there, and generally speaking most maps only have 4 PUs: Core, Grotto, Heights... Cave has 2, Lost City has 3. I'd suggest taking out two from the middle area.

What kinda graphical direction are you planning on taking?

[Jayfourke]

Thanks for the comments, I'll get to work on those ASAP.

As far as graphics go, I think boko's interested in doing something, where I basically said, make the triangles look like crystals, red on one side, blue on the other, fade to purple mid.

However, I had a mild epithany on the train earlier today, and I was thinking about making it like a volcano shooting debris.

I was thinking, if I make the pointy bit bottom mid look like a volcano, and make the triangles more like debris and not triangles (as already pointed out) it might be nice.

Oh, and a black background, because it hurts people's eyes otherwise.

[innerlyte]

Sounds cool. I can see the volcano thing working. Regarding the background, I wouldn't go with straight black, as the contrast can sometimes be a bit much. People complain the least with bland-ish low contrast colors.

Regarding the turret and base layout, I found things a bit congested. The object just above the back of the base can probably go. The only planes it will hinder are the base's owners. I'd push the object above the front of the base out to give a little more breathing room as well. You want to allow people to get in and heal/defend quickly. As for the turrets, you can probably extend their range a little and reduce redundancy. Refer to the mock-up below for one possible layout. It's pretty rough, but you'll get the idea.


[Remove X'ed turrets and rotate the circled one to cover the mid to upper threat.]

[Jayfourke]

Alright, here's V3, although it really doesn't fit the name "Shard" anymore... I took a lot of advice, including dropping the plane spawns, scattering the turrets, and making the base more open.



Download link: http://rapidshare.com/files/430486998/tbd_shard3.altx

Next job is some form of graphical update, ahaha. Comments welcomed, as always!

[innerlyte]

That looks much better. Before, there seemed to be too many objects on the field, and you did a good job of simplifying things here. Will let you know how it plays. Also, if you or boko want help with the graphical side of things, I wouldn't mind taking a shot at it.

[sunshineduck]

I think there should be another turret up top, otherwise it's wide open for lobs even early on

[Jayfourke]

OK, as far as graphics go, this is all I've got.



Innerlyte, feel free to take a shot. I'm thinking this colour scheme, but with more detail. So cracks in the rocks oozing lava, and a big plume shooting up out of the middle.

EDIT: I'm done. Importing the map from photoshop into alty editor broke my lappy on multiple occasions, guess it can't handle the geoms.

Here's the d/load link, but don't worry, the background is dark grey. Enjoy it, and feel free to skin it, I'd really appreciate it.

http://rapidshare.com/files/430682977/tbd_shard4.altx

[innerlyte]

Ok, here is something I whipped up today. It's still pretty rough, but maybe something along these lines would work?

[Jayfourke]

Pretty nice there, but I was hoping for a more cartoony style, which is why I'd started off with the bold, hand-drawn esque lines.

Also, more magma! and flames! And 'splosions! lol

[silent skies]

If you're going to use a texture, I'd suggest starting with a flat texture (i.e. little to no shading at all) and then add your own lighting effects.

It's a neat texture, but at the moment all the map geography sort of feels like cardboard cutouts.

[innerlyte]

Ah, thanks for the feedback ^^ This is just a mock-up though. I didn't want to put a ton of time into it, and then have Jay or someone else decide to go in a different direction.

By the way, is there any progress being made with this map? How is Boko's design idea coming along?

[Jayfourke]

I'm done with it, like I said, cos it's killing my lappy and I'm satisfied with it. I've not heard anything back from Boko, and besides, he was using the older, angular version which is OOOOLD now anyway.

So yeah, feel free to go wild on your design.

[Jayfourke]

BUMP, cos I got motivated... it was meant to be simple, adding some shadowing and a simple gradient background. Long story short, my comp really can't handle this, it BSOD'd on me and crashed more than once. And it's STILL NOT WORKING. So here's a link to what I've got thus far. Layers in use are 1-4, no idea what order they're meant to be in, and the population of mumble was no help either.

Oh, and for some reason, it won't play because the planes are spawning into a wall. No ****ing idea why. Gentlemen, I wash my hands of this madness. Please fix it, so we can all play it, I reckon it's a pretty fun map.

D/load link: http://rapidshare.com/files/431924557/tbd_shard4.altx

Thanks.

[innerlyte]

The map editor can be a bit fidgetty. When you import an image, the editor auto-detects the image's edges and creates collidable boundaries from this information. If the editor cannot readily detect an image's edges, unwanted behavior can arise, like in this case. If you open up the editor and select "Collision Fill," while deselecting "Graphic" and "Collision Outline" within the Filter View panel, you will see what I mean. All of the red areas are considered to be collidable. At this point, you have a couple options. You can either try to edit the hulls within the editor or clean up the images in your external image editor. I usually choose the latter approach.

Regarding the current state of this map's graphics, I'm cooking something up. I don't have an exact timetable on its completion, but I'm guessing it'll be done within a week. Again, if anyone else feels like taking a stab at this, feel free. If my idea pans out though, it will be worth the wait ^^

[innerlyte]

So, I FINALLY got around to skinning this map. The version I am posting here is almost identical to Jayfourke's original layout. I removed the collision objects around the map perimeter for various reasons, but the edges remain impassible. I made an alternate layout as well. Will post back with the forum link. Hope you guys enjoy.

-red



Download

Link to Version 2