Patch: January 19th, new skins, control tweaks, bug fixes

[Aero_Beast]

Originally Posted by Gruntbuggly

So my game playing style was removed, why? And mouse/keyboard users are forced to learn the game all over again with the new 'more advantageous' keyboard only to suit whose whims?
Think you find it will just turn people away.

Mouse+kb had this 4 inch line on the screen for no reason other then a visual indicator and to give a big aiming advantage. They took away the line but kept the cross hair for the indicator(yes it needs some tweaking). Personally ive been playing with mouse+kb for about 250 hours and I find that I aim just as well with just the cross hair as i did with the line maybe even better in some situations because you can put the cross hair wherever you want. The patch hasnt even been out a day and your bashing the changes without giving it a chance learn to adapt. Pure mouse requires the line for throttle taking it away from pure would make it very hard to play.

[VipMattMan]

Originally Posted by Gruntbuggly

It's more than a matter of crosshair visibility Matt. When I play, I watch my plane and my periphery vision keeps track of where I'm steering. I'm not watching the crosshair darting over the far reaches of my screen. The concept of mouse control relies on the ability to watch your plane and have the guidance marker (cross hair or throttle line) close by, not in some random place somewhere that you have no idea about because you've been forced to turn quickly or thermoed or the like.
So yes it would be a relearning if you were forced to use mouse-only for the sake of having a decent localised direction marker

Here's part of my first post in the original Mouse-advantage thread:

Originally Posted by VipMattMan

I think the bar helps tremendously with orientation. When you're using mouse aiming as it is right now you don't really watch your plane or only the crosshair, you watch the action ahead. Having the bar there keeps you from having to focus directly on the cross hair going all over the place because you always have that extra visual cue showing your orientation in relation to the crosshair.

In essence, i agree that you need extra visual cues. I still think a shortened line would be a good visual cue, as opposed to nothing at all, because of the differences in the way you use your vision with mouse.

I don't agree that the full-fledged bar is needed, and while a shortened line would be helpful, I'm not entirely sure it would be "needed" after the crosshair has been fixed.

[pandas.gotta.gun]

seeing as this game now appears to be turning into a balancing nightmare of unnecessary nerfs and buffs much like the other games ive left in the past i was wondering if at this juncture would it be possible to get a refund of some sort for this game since it doesnt appear that the basic game controls and setup i started playing this game with are going to go back into effect.

if i had any inkling of an idea that the basic controls for my playing style mouse+keyboard were going to be modified to this garbage i wouldnt have even bothered with it.

not only is my visible reference bar missing but i now have the luxury of my pointer suddenly orientating itself elsewhere or disappearing entirely. i dont recall having to wiggle my mouse around constantly like ive got parkinson's to make sure the game didnt think i was tabbed out before either.

i even played around after this patch a bit to try and give it a chance but screw that. handicapping a player just because he uses better hardware is a real dick move especially after your games already out there and being played. this is the kind of **** you work out in the testing phases of developing a program.

WoW and the like nerfs and buffs characters and attacks. assholes that wanna lose clients radically change the game as you have.

i might be hasty is my judgement but ive come to notice once changes start being made to something that isnt broken to begin with that more changes come to fix the new ones and it becomes a snowball effect and god knows if the new problems will be fixed.

cool skins though

[RockRidX]

I think that I also will just go if this stays the same I had brought some friends in too, and they hated the keyboard method and showed them how to use mouse turning only and set throttle controls to mouse and they loved it. No point in staying here complaining if thats they way the games moving then im out, im not spending another 200 hrs learning randa again

[blln4lyf]

Originally Posted by VipMattMan

Not completely true.

Using keyboard only you can turn while tricky-reversing backwards. You have a constant axis during that process.

Keyboard + Mouse with the old method of tricky reverse allowed you to have a variable axis in that process. That did indeed allow the potential for a very slight advantage of control over keyboard only users, for those that mastered it.

Keyboard + Mouse with the new system has a brief dead time where you tricky straight backwards without any axis at all. You then have to identify a new cursor location and begin turning from that point.

IMO the axis system of tricky for Mouse+KB was more similar to keyboard in its previous state than the current one, barring the whole single-button perfect turn-back element.

If new users learn the new system of tricky mouse+kb then they're going to be disadvantaged to both keyboard only and old-system mouse/keyboard users. I say when people are playing mouse and unlock randa for the first time, pop up a little help message that asks them whether they want to use traditional or simplified tricky controls (with traditional listed first). At least that would put it in their heads that there is a notable difference between the two, and that it's selectable in options.

Ah, didn't mess around without enough to notice the dead time. In that case I agree with you in theory.

[CCN]

So Wow, the most successful PC game of all time, minting billions of dollars is your example of a game doing it rong?

K.

[pandas.gotta.gun]

Originally Posted by CCN

So Wow, the most successful PC game of all time, minting billions of dollars is your example of a game doing it rong?

K.

if this is a reply to me no your really missing the point. WoW tells you upfront they are constantly going to change **** and they do constantly nerf and buff characters and attacks (though thats a given with mmorpgs). what they do not do is radically change gameplay because someone uses better hardware.

regardless WoW is a mmorgp and altitude is a dinky lil 2d flight sim game. i threw out the name WoW because it gave a better illustration of a game that buffs and nerfs select playable entities. as successful as it is you go into playing WoW knowing they are going to change **** around constantly because of the type of game it is. altitude should not be like that. since it is ill probably do as RockRidX is doing.

[blln4lyf]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

since it is ill probably do as RockRidX is doing.

Altitude rarely ever changes anything that effects gameplay... 1 change means it makes changes like WoW?

[Zombi]

I bought a copy for my pal, checkers randa is TOO MUCH awesome.

Thanks Karl and Lamster

[VipMattMan]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

if this is a reply to me no your really missing the point. WoW tells you upfront they are constantly going to change **** and they do constantly nerf and buff characters and attacks (though thats a given with mmorpgs). what they do not do is radically change gameplay because someone uses better hardware.

regardless WoW is a mmorgp and altitude is a dinky lil 2d flight sim game. i threw out the name WoW because it gave a better illustration of a game that buffs and nerfs select playable entities. as successful as it is you go into playing WoW knowing they are going to change **** around constantly because of the type of game it is. altitude was not and should not be like that.

About 7 months ago there was a change in Altitude. Mouse control was implemented. This implementation added visual elements that no other control system had, because it wasn't otherwise suited for gameplay without those visual elements.

If people had really been paying attention at the time, I'm sure there would have been cries about mouse being "buffed", simply because the hardware was "inferior" for the type of game this was.

If Altitude wasn't the kind of game that changed over time, you wouldn't have ever played Mouse+KB in the first place.

I'm personally glad that the devs are still willing to add features while attempting to work out the kinks of gameplay balance. Unfortunately in the land of game-design you rarely get things absolutely perfect on the first try.

Make some middle-ground suggestions. Come up with something good and I'm sure the devs will be happy to listen.

[pandas.gotta.gun]

Yeah just browsed the forums and noticed all the patch discussion. Really should have made all these changes during the testing phases I got into this game after the steam sale. Will be sure to research that my future game purchased arnt made by people that use its players as unpaid testers.

You want a suggestion roll back the changes or an option to play with the setup before the patch. Good for the devs for coming up with mouse plus keyboard after the fact but I don't purchase and play a game just to have to relearn how to play everytime the dev's feel like throwing up control changes with a new patch.

[elxir]

i want a lazer sight added to my plane that autotargets goals bases and enemy plains

thank you that is all

[Ribilla]

It literally cannot understand what all this whinging is about. Everything was discussed in extreme detail in this thread:

http://altitudegame.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5577

If you cannot be bothered to offer your opinion when changes are being discussed then you have no right at all to complain about those changes. Lam is not stupid, he does not want to 'punish' you for using mouse he is trying to get better parity between control schemes based on community feedback. Whether or not I agree with the changes is a moot point, you cannot fault the devs for implementing what a large percentage of the community was calling for. If you wish to complain, first read that entrie thread, then post your opinion there.

After playing with the new randa scheme for a while, I find it difficult to get used to and I am glad we will have the option in the next patch.

My suggestion, which might make it easier to learn is to change the way the cursor realigns:

Currently it appears to flip 180 degrees from the cursors current position, this means that if you are turning or dogfighting as you reverse, your cursor ends up in completely the wrong location. Much better would be if your cursor flipped so that when you reversed it would always be infront of your plane.

In order to get around the drift problem, it might be best if the cursor always reset to a set distance from the plane (full throttle), so that you never need lift up your mouse.


To try and illustrate my point, try moving the mouse just over 90 degrees upwards whilst flying right and then reverse, you end up flying into the ground, whereas you probably wanted to fly left. In a close-quarters dogfight it is very difficult not to crash with the current system.

[MajorPayne257]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

Yeah just browsed the forums and noticed all the patch discussion. Really should have made all these changes during the testing phases I got into this game after the steam sale. Will be sure to research that my future game purchased arnt made by people that use its players as unpaid testers.

You want a suggestion roll back the changes or an option to play with the setup before the patch. Good for the devs for coming up with mouse plus keyboard after the fact but I don't purchase and play a game just to have to relearn how to play everytime the dev's feel like throwing up control changes with a new patch.

Your attempts to compare Altitude with WoW are a joke, at best.

Altitude's community is extremely small, with the forum community being even smaller. This naturally leads to a tight-knit and very familiar atmosphere, which is something that most games do not have. How many games have you played where almost every single day you're interacting with the devs, either through the forums or actually playing with them in-game?

Karl and Lam spend countless hours reading through each and every suggestion on these forums, as well as threads such as the "Mouse advantage" thread. They spend as much, if not more, time coming up with the best solution and then implementing it - all for a game that really doesn't make them that much money.

You paid what, $5? Maybe even $2.50 when it was on sale? Surely no more than $20. The devs know what they're doing, and they are constantly looking for feedback and ideas on how to improve.

How about you help them out with some ideas on how it can be improved and more balanced instead of raging about leaving after one day post implementation? Read through this thread and see what you agree/disagree with.

Lam has clearly said that they will be fixing the crosshair issues as well as continuing to think about what the best possible solution is to this situation.

As for me, I am more than happy to be Karlam's test dummy for anything new in Altitude. They created one of the greatest games on Earth (imo) and continue to support it 24/7. It's the least I can do really.

[blln4lyf]

Originally Posted by MajorPayne257

Your attempts to compare Altitude with WoW are a joke, at best.

Altitude's community is extremely small, with the forum community being even smaller. This naturally leads to a tight-knit and very familiar atmosphere, which is something that most games do not have. How many games have you played where almost every single day you're interacting with the devs, either through the forums or actually playing with them in-game?

Karl and Lam spend countless hours reading through each and every suggestion on these forums, as well as threads such as the "Mouse advantage" thread. They spend as much, if not more, time coming up with the best solution and then implementing it - all for a game that really doesn't make them that much money.

You paid what, $5? Maybe even $2.50 when it was on sale? Surely no more than $20. The devs know what they're doing, and they are constantly looking for feedback and ideas on how to improve.

How about you help them out with some ideas on how it can be improved and more balanced instead of raging about leaving after one day post implementation? Read through this thread and see what you agree/disagree with.

Lam has clearly said that they will be fixing the crosshair issues as well as continuing to think about what the best possible solution is to this situation.

As for me, I am more than happy to be Karlam's test dummy for anything new in Altitude. They created one of the greatest games on Earth (imo) and continue to support it 24/7. It's the least I can do really.

Post of the Year imo

[RockRidX]

TBH in my case its a lack of educating myself, I didnt think things this fundamental would be chaning. I was just blissfully happy and unaware playing the game and not surfing the forums.

Me I'm not happy to be a beta tester on things like this, I'm fine with planes getting 'nerfed' and 'buffed' but the movement scheme just seemed untouchable in my mind. I dunno I'm rambaling as for some sort of suggestion, I've thought long and hard about this and really cant come up with anything that isint an advantage to mouse users. Maby give the keyboard users a choice to turn on the throttle indicator for them.

[Premier Stalin]

But.That.Wud.be.Gay.

[pandas.gotta.gun]

these discussions might be common knowledge to you but i wasnt aware of them until i got ****ing irritated with the new patch. might make some sort of mention when you start the ****ing game that were part of testing that should have occurred before it was on sale in what people tend to call the beta testing phase. works kinda like this you know instead of a stripped down demo and buy full version have the full version available during beta testing until you work out all the kinks then put it on the market or hell sell preorders unlocking the full thing but make it clear its still in the testing stages and has not officially had everything set in stone.

nothing about the game says hey give us feedback so we can change huge **** tons of the game wither on the market or even on the front load because were bastards and you bought a game thats not even ****ing finished.

[elxir]

it's not "testing" it's adjustments that are made based on player-initiated feedback.

[Demuyt]

Dude, you should seriously take a look at what's going on around you before you start throwing insults at Altitude.

I'm too lazy to start writing an essay about it now, but if you are not pleased with the amazing efforts the developers do for the community, the constant help they are offering to anyone who is experiencing a problem with the game, the player ideas they are working on implementing to the game... <JLquote>Please return to your hating life in Hateville in Hateland. </JLquote>

[[Y]]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

these discussions might be common knowledge to you but i wasnt aware of them until i got ****ing irritated with the new patch. might make some sort of mention when you start the ****ing game that were part of testing that should have occurred before it was on sale in what people tend to call the beta testing phase. works kinda like this you know instead of a stripped down demo and buy full version have the full version available during beta testing until you work out all the kinks then put it on the market or hell sell preorders unlocking the full thing but make it clear its still in the testing stages and has not officially had everything set in stone.

nothing about the game says hey give us feedback so we can change huge **** tons of the game wither on the market or even on the front load because were bastards and you bought a game thats not even ****ing finished.

lol .

[Premier Stalin]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

we're bastards and you bought a game thats not even ****ing finished.

oh no he didnt :O

[Ribilla]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

these discussions might be common knowledge to you but i wasnt aware of them until i got ****ing irritated with the new patch. might make some sort of mention when you start the ****ing game that were part of testing that should have occurred before it was on sale in what people tend to call the beta testing phase. works kinda like this you know instead of a stripped down demo and buy full version have the full version available during beta testing until you work out all the kinks then put it on the market or hell sell preorders unlocking the full thing but make it clear its still in the testing stages and has not officially had everything set in stone.

nothing about the game says hey give us feedback so we can change huge **** tons of the game wither on the market or even on the front load because were bastards and you bought a game thats not even ****ing finished.

I think you misunderstand what beta testing is. Could you please make a list of the decent online games that have not had any game changes since release. I shall prepare a list of ones that have had continuous updates and we can have a little party where we compare lists and you find out that you are wrong in every sense of the word.

[pandas.gotta.gun]

this ****ty little self inclusive forum based community that i didnt even know existed until yesterday can suck my dick. the game was fine how it was and now its craptacular. the very nature of testing is based on the feedback of players or users wither it was initially setup that way or not thats still what it is. the fact of the matter is that it being unofficially being tested and modified is far more repulsive than just it being in the testing phase because you can pretty well consider that the game will continue to change so long as the devs dont shut down this ****ty little forum and tell us all to **** off with our suggestions and complaints.

its especially irritating for people like me who liked the game how it was when we started playing it and had no knowledge of this bull**** with feedback and change to begin with.

basically what im hearing is yall are a close net bunch of forum faggots that dont give a damn about people who just buy and play the game the way it was initially advertised at the time of purchase. if theres enough positive feedback to say change the planes into dicks&balls that shoot jizz the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

[GGQ]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

this ****ty little self inclusive forum based community that i didnt even know existed until yesterday can suck my dick. the game was fine how it was and now its craptacular. the very nature of testing is based on the feedback of players or users wither it was initially setup that way or not thats still what it is. the fact of the matter is that it being unofficially being tested and modified is far more repulsive than just it being in the testing phase because you can pretty well consider that the game will continue to change so long as the devs dont shut down this ****ty little forum and tell us all to **** off with our suggestions and complaints.

its especially irritating for people like me who liked the game how it was when we started playing it and had no knowledge of this bull**** with feedback and change to begin with.

basically what im hearing is yall are a close net bunch of forum faggots that dont give a damn about people who just buy and play the game the way it was initially advertised at the time of purchase. if theres enough positive feedback to say change the planes into dicks&balls that shoot jizz the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

Just gtfo, then. Please. No one's gonna miss you.

[nobodyhome]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

basically what im hearing is yall are a close net bunch of forum faggots that dont give a damn about people who just buy and play the game the way it was initially advertised at the time of purchase. if theres enough positive feedback to say change the planes into dicks&balls that shoot jizz the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

so you're blaming the devs for... listening to the community and making the game better based on what we the players want? that's good, damn right they should be. if tomorrow i post a thread suggesting that all the planes be changed into dicks and balls that shoot jizz and the entire community posts saying that they would love it if the game did that, they better damn well change our planes into jizz-shooting dicks and balls. if they don't do this then i'm getting the hell out of this place and never again playing a game made by money grubbing whores who just assume that once we buy the game and have already given them our money they can just not care about what we think.

[Mr. Moooo]

Originally Posted by nobodyhome

so you're blaming the devs for... listening to the community and making the game better based on what we the players want? that's good, damn right they should be. if tomorrow i post a thread suggesting that all the planes be changed into dicks and balls that shoot jizz and the entire community posts saying that they would love it if the game did that, they better damn well change our planes into jizz-shooting dicks and balls. if they don't do this then i'm getting the hell out of this place and never again playing a game made by money grubbing whores who just assume that once we buy the game and have already given them our money they can just not care about what we think.

I think "Blasty Mc****" already put that request in

[mikesol]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

this ****ty little self inclusive forum based community that i didnt even know existed until yesterday can suck my dick. the game was fine how it was and now its craptacular. the very nature of testing is based on the feedback of players or users wither it was initially setup that way or not thats still what it is. the fact of the matter is that it being unofficially being tested and modified is far more repulsive than just it being in the testing phase because you can pretty well consider that the game will continue to change so long as the devs dont shut down this ****ty little forum and tell us all to **** off with our suggestions and complaints.

its especially irritating for people like me who liked the game how it was when we started playing it and had no knowledge of this bull**** with feedback and change to begin with.

basically what im hearing is yall are a close net bunch of forum faggots that dont give a damn about people who just buy and play the game the way it was initially advertised at the time of purchase. if theres enough positive feedback to say change the planes into dicks&balls that shoot jizz the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

You sir need to calm down. People are not going to take you seriously if you spend 95% of your post cussing and insulting others. So how about we take a breath and try and talk through this.

Lamster, one of the developers, has already said that they might allow users to revert back some of the changes - such as the cursor flipping. He is definitely listening to feedback on this. Perhaps he might even add back in your precious line.

You talk about testing as if this community has enough people to actually test it. This game is made by two - yes two - people. The community is so small that if they even tried to set up a test server - it could ruin the experience of other players by not having other people to play with. This isn't blizzard with millions of dollars and thousands of slaves who would give up anything to test the game.

So yes - the users are forced to "test" things. The developers are constantly trying to improve this game. Did you know ball was a user suggestion? With this constant FREE updating of the game as they add things comes possible side effects.

Mouse plus keyboard was determined to be unfair. As a keyboard user - why should you not be affected by thermo missiles as much? Why should you have a line that let's you have ridiculously better accuracy? In my eyes, you shouldn't.

Nonetheless, as with every update, the developers listen - even to people who rage like you - and try and come up with acceptable alternatives. Often times updates are rolled back or things are changed after users feel very upset over them.

So before you freak out even more and rage quit - how about taking a step back and come up with some alternatives. For instance - would a curved line be fair for you? Would a bigger cursor help? Is there some other thing that could be added to appease you?

[Sunaku]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

Suddenly, I'm not so eager to see the next plane skins anymore.

[Premier Stalin]

Originally Posted by GGQ

Just gtfo, then. Please. No one's gonna miss you.

+1.

and Sunaku I dont think people who rage like this on forums, have much to fit on scanners.

[Aero_Beast]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

these discussions might be common knowledge to you but i wasnt aware of them until i got ****ing irritated with the new patch. might make some sort of mention when you start the ****ing game that were part of testing that should have occurred before it was on sale in what people tend to call the beta testing phase. works kinda like this you know instead of a stripped down demo and buy full version have the full version available during beta testing until you work out all the kinks then put it on the market or hell sell preorders unlocking the full thing but make it clear its still in the testing stages and has not officially had everything set in stone.

nothing about the game says hey give us feedback so we can change huge **** tons of the game wither on the market or even on the front load because were bastards and you bought a game thats not even ****ing finished.

LOL @ THIS KID im a mouse player and can you just remove mouse till this douchebag leave ill play kb for a while

[Blue]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

this ****ty little self inclusive forum based community that i didnt even know existed until yesterday can suck my dick. the game was fine how it was and now its craptacular. the very nature of testing is based on the feedback of players or users wither it was initially setup that way or not thats still what it is. the fact of the matter is that it being unofficially being tested and modified is far more repulsive than just it being in the testing phase because you can pretty well consider that the game will continue to change so long as the devs dont shut down this ****ty little forum and tell us all to **** off with our suggestions and complaints.

its especially irritating for people like me who liked the game how it was when we started playing it and had no knowledge of this bull**** with feedback and change to begin with.

basically what im hearing is yall are a close net bunch of forum faggots that dont give a damn about people who just buy and play the game the way it was initially advertised at the time of purchase. if theres enough positive feedback to say change the planes into dicks&balls that shoot jizz the devs would hop right on that idea and do just that right after slapping their johnson on a scanner.

Dude, chill. The fact that you even said anything is rediculous, then you go on and swear to the devs about inappropriate topics like dicks and jizz? you sir ned to calm down. Heres all you have to do, block this website from your internet browwser, delete altitude, and get on with your life.

[Selfish Lover]

Originally Posted by pandas.gotta.gun

blah blah blah

Karl, Lam....keep doing what you guys are doing. This is the best game in the world, regardless of what one misinformed person believes. Thank you for all the hard work that you have put into this game. I don't regret a single one of the 320 hours that I have spent in the skies of Altitude. You guys are the best!

[Demuyt]

You got owned by the little ****ty self inclusive community and its mods.

Just trying to imagine his face when he was writing that post makes me rofl.

Karl, Lam, I am begging you, don't listen to this guy ! Every word Lover has said is true, Altitude is way better than all the big FPS and MMORPG titles and the work that you put into it is amazing !

[Gruntbuggly]

Originally Posted by Demuyt

Karl, Lam, I am begging you, don't listen to this guy ! Every word Lover has said is true, Altitude is way better than all the big FPS and MMORPG titles and the work that you put into it is amazing !

Completely agree, fantastic game and that's why people are cranky when a change is made, because they love the game so much. Great job making such a fantastic game (just fix the mouse/keyboard or we'll find another cool indie game to play :P ).

[Aero_Beast]

Originally Posted by Gruntbuggly

Completely agree, fantastic game and that's why people are cranky when a change is made, because they love the game so much. Great job making such a fantastic game (just fix the mouse/keyboard or we'll find another cool indie game to play :P ).

They are trying to fix the advantage mouse had over kb and there was an advantage and to say there wasnt is just bias.

[Snail]

Originally Posted by Aero_Beast

They are trying to fix the advantage mouse had over kb and there was an advantage and to say there wasnt is just bias.

and what you are saying right there is not a bias?

I am not going to argue about the fairness of an aiming line for kb+mouse users, since I have no personal experience with it, so dont take the following too personal if you mean just that... but for full-mouse, the way it was before this automatic BS patch, was exactly the way to go for me and a few others, and there are VERY few people actually using the method, since it is not exactly easy to learn. I am not saying keyboard is easy, I would crash with it in no time.. But almost noone I ever met in the game uses full-mouse, and also the top players are not all mouse users, not even close.

so, if mouse is so imba, why are there so few people doing it? and why cant you leave us the hell alone?

I could start bitching about keyboard users being able to do steady circles with their whales, or about the precision of keyboard throttle control, which is unachievable with the mouse.

do you see me doing it? no. and why?

because, unlike many "ban mouse!"-fascists in here, I realize that a mouse experience can UNDER NO CONDITIONS EVER be the same as a keyboard experience. you have to decide for yourself what suits you, your plane and your gamestyle best, and live with it, but also let other people live with their means of control.

deliberately telling the devs to **** up other peoples controls just so you can feel better about yourself is nothing but weakness. it is even more incredibly dumb then bitching about a plane class being imba, since they are all ballanced. yes, even the loopy, yes, even when it pisses me off with EMP. there are not many GOOD loopy players, as well as there arent many good mouse players, as there are not many good players in general.

[Selfish Lover]

Originally Posted by Snail

and what you are saying right there is not a bias?

I am not going to argue about the fairness of an aiming line for kb+mouse users, since I have no personal experience with it, so dont take the following too personal if you mean just that... but for full-mouse, the way it was before this automatic BS patch, was exactly the way to go for me and a few others, and there are VERY few people actually using the method, since it is not exactly easy to learn. I am not saying keyboard is easy, I would crash with it in no time.. But almost noone I ever met in the game uses full-mouse, and also the top players are not all mouse users, not even close.

so, if mouse is so imba, why are there so few people doing it? and why cant you leave us the hell alone?

I could start bitching about keyboard users being able to do steady circles with their whales, or about the precision of keyboard throttle control, which is unachievable with the mouse.

do you see me doing it? no. and why?

because, unlike many "ban mouse!"-fascists in here, I realize that a mouse experience can UNDER NO CONDITIONS EVER be the same as a keyboard experience. you have to decide for yourself what suits you, your plane and your gamestyle best, and live with it, but also let other people live with their means of control.

deliberately telling the devs to **** up other peoples controls just so you can feel better about yourself is nothing but weakness. it is even more incredibly dumb then bitching about a plane class being imba, since they are all ballanced. yes, even the loopy, yes, even when it pisses me off with EMP. there are not many GOOD loopy players, as well as there arent many good mouse players, as there are not many good players in general.

There is a whole other thread that focuses on the mouse vs keyboard debate. Just saying.....Take the pissing contest over there.

[Aero_Beast]

I understand what you are saying snail but being a mouse+kb player that line was unnecessary and added a significant aiming advantage to kb users. Mouse is a lot newer then kb so the amount of people playing it is a lot smaller along with the amount of time played with it.

[Urpee]

I still think that people way overstate the advantage of the line but I don't mind it being gone so., to me that's an academic debate.

In any case the real problem for me now is that the crosshairs is definitely too hard to detect and that I am way too often disoriented. The cross hairs does need to be somewhat bigger and needs stronger contrast.

This makes the moved mouse cursor after thermo even more deadly because often one cannot even find where the heck that thing got moved to.

mouse+kb is still good for angle shots, but how often do I get to even attempt an angle shot compared to the times I cannot even find the cursor now.

The change definitely has severely changed my competitiveness, primarily due to the crosshairs problem. I certainly cannot play ladder and expect to be competitive right now because the issue is just too common and the cognitive load to try to not lose the cursor is rather excessive and I either lose sight of the crosshairs or of the surroundings.