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#1
04-01-2010, 06:26 AM
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Patch: Mar 31st, biplane/bomber balance adjustments, bug fixes
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March 31st, 2010 Biplane (All Forms) increased turning rate by 1.5% (6.5 -> 6.6) Biplane (Dogfighter, Recoilless) increased primary weapon ejection velocity (17 -> 19, note: reduced lifetime so that max travel distance is unchanged) Biplane (Dogfighter, Recoilless) slightly increased primary weapon damage (38 -> 39) Biplane (Heavy Cannon) slightly increased primary weapon damage (109 -> 112) Bomber (All Forms) decreased turning rate by 2.9% (7.0 -> 6.8) Tightened Miranda teleport collision check to prevent exploits Fixed a bug that prevented Steam players from changing their nickname Fixed a few miscellaneous bugs ------------------------------------- For those who've mastered the Miranda teleport-through-wall exploit: please let me know if this patch has fully resolved the issue. If there are still problems please private message me with detailed reproduction steps (map name, exact position required, video if available) and I'll fix them up. Last edited by lamster; 04-01-2010 at 06:59 AM. 
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#2
04-01-2010, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
QQ Queue in 3...2...1...
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#3
04-01-2010, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
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#5
04-01-2010, 06:44 AM
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I had the teleport down to a fine art...key word HAD. You've definitely fixed the problem. I would assume that's a good thing...although I will definitely miss getting kicked, threatened and sworn at.
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#6
04-01-2010, 06:50 AM
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Not that I'm a pro bomber by any means, but I think the turn rate is fine for BALL. It's a bit trickier/slower to make a u-turn, but otherwise I don't notice much difference.
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#10
04-01-2010, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
buff D:{
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#11
04-01-2010, 08:01 AM
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Ahhh biplane! Yay! Bomber didn't really need a nerf but mmkay. Ill go do that randa teleport tomorrow can't today since i have to travel.
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#12
04-01-2010, 08:04 AM
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Nice stuff. Initial impressions are that the changes are very faint, but we did notice some things like HC being able to 3 shot a HA bomber instead of 4 now. Will have to play more to get a feel of whether biplane is balanced now.
Keep the good work coming!
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#13
04-01-2010, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Thanks a lot Lamster, great work 
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#14
04-01-2010, 08:15 AM
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huzzah! good changes all around!
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#15
04-01-2010, 08:48 AM
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Seems good. I tried a few maps and i couldn't go through walls since I died much faster than before the patch. I tried just 1 min, tho.
The only spot where i managed to do this was on the central tower in lostcity (see image, anchor line shows the path). Not that is a big deal, it's useless to do that there. Since it's still possible, my guess is that the thru-wall pros will still manage to do it to cross to the other side. =) 
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#16
04-01-2010, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
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#19
04-01-2010, 01:41 PM
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As a biplane user; Thanks you so much!
And it doesn't seem unbalanced now either. Great update!
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#21
04-01-2010, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
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#22
04-01-2010, 04:25 PM
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Biplane gets some respect finally. Clef! HEAVY CANNON BABY!!!!!
oh yeah, shame on you for messing with BOMBER!!!!! YOU CAN LOWER THE TURN RATE TO .0000000000000001% I WILL STILL FIND YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Last edited by Pieface; 04-01-2010 at 05:56 PM. Reason: merged posts
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#26
04-01-2010, 07:40 PM
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Now all thats needed is to slightly rebuff remote mine and everyone is happy
Nice update.
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#32
04-02-2010, 12:48 AM
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This yet again shows that you guys listen to the community. I haven't had the time to test yet so I can't really say if it's a good balance update, but it definitely follows on the lines of the community discussions lately. Good job!
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#33
04-02-2010, 10:55 PM
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I've had a chance to play the biplane a bit since the patch. For the most part, the changes were so subtle, I hardly noticed them (which, I'm sure, was intentional), but I think there is still more balancing to be done. The idea of a turning buff was nice, but again, not noticeable. In terms of the weapons buff, I thought it was a little odd that primaries were upgraded. Referring to the latest biplane topic thread, I only remember seeing people suggesting a secondary buff, as that seemed to be the most logical. Of course, the devs may have a different goal in mind, so we have to take the changes at whim. Since I've never been exceptional with either recoilless of dogfighter, I'll let someone else comment on the patch in that area. As for HC, I can kind of understand that the primary received the buff to make it even more of a sniping plane, but it still feels frustrating that secondary really does so little. Granted, you're only going to use it in close combat situations when you have enough energy for F+D, but sometimes you only have enough energy for D, which, in isolation, feels about as effective as a misting fan.
Overall, I think it was nice that the biplane got a buff, but I honestly don't see it bringing the plane back into competitive games. I will reiterate my suggestion from before, I think HC should receive full pierce (or at least a more substantial pierce) as it did in beta. I think it sounds reasonable since you are a)not increasing the primary's DPS and b)not increasing it's RoF. It really would make that build unique, allowing it to snipe a bomb carrier through escorts. I don't see much harm in increasing secondary either, since it's range is so short. Since you can only fire off a couple HC shells at full energy, you will spend a lot off time jamming F with no result. This is especially detrimental when it close quarters with enemy planes. A secondary buff would be helpful in competitive play, but perhaps a little imba in pub games. I realize it's a balancing act that you (lam/karl) are playing, but I'm hoping you have more in mind for lam's favorite plane
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#36
04-03-2010, 02:19 AM
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To be honest, I really don't. Perhaps I'm just not very sensitive to fine adjustments. Of course, I use reverse thrust in my set-up, so I really wouldn't notice the turning buff as much as flexi wings users. Anyway, the point of my previous post was mainly to be taken into the competitive context. Would you now choose to pilot a biplane in an important APL or ladder game or would you stick with bomber or loopy? Part of what makes every other plane so effective in the competitive setting is their ability to affect multiple opponents simultaneously (excluding perhaps the Miranda, but since it is so ridiculously agile, it doesn't matter). The biplane really doesn't have that ability. And since it's middle of the road in speed, health, and agility, there are usually better options out there. My suggestion to reintroduce pierce would give the biplane (or at least one version of it) the ability to damage multiple planes, making it more effective in crowd control. On a one-on-one level, the biplane has never really been underpowered. Adding pierce back wouldn't really imbalance that facet of play.
Regarding the other 2 setups, perhaps the most recent buff was enough. I don't really know. I would say that is more in your department, GGQ, and I trust your opinion. I do, however, think HC has been the weakest of the 3 since halfway through last year. Bringing biplane back into competitive play would be great, though, since I'm tired of always playing bomber and explo.
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#37
04-03-2010, 03:15 PM
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AS an almost exclusive HC/biplane player, i can say this: while the buff is a step in the right direction, i don't feel it has levelled the playing field. The damage buff to HC.. i didn't see any difference.. some1 said it serves something along the lines of needing 3 shots instead of 4 to snipe a HA bomber.. which is a situation so remote as to not matter..I do like the projectile speed increase for DF/Recoiless, i find it the most usefull thing about this patch.
The turning buff is nowhere sufficient to dispense with flexi wings( imo) , and at least for me all it did was completly mess up my HC aim. I am still struggling after a few days to get back to the level of reflex snipes that i had before the patch.. having to think a shot instead of just letting one off "by feel" and watching it connect at the edge of the screen. By no means is this a bad thing for biplane, it's a step in the right direction, but as it's been said before, i do not feel it fixes what's wrong with it. Better pierce would imo give the biplane a role in stopping pushes with the bomb at the rear. In 5v5 league play, i find i have to move aside or be swept away by the enemies' push, and try to be a last resort weapon, sniping the enemy bomb carrier from the side before it gets a chance to release.. I have logged over 150 hrs flying HC exclusively, and the number of times i got a doublekill from pierce, even in a 10v10 is so small as not to matter. Secondary.. well it's a hail mary attempt at best.. a buff to it would help with the hunter killer role of the biplane, but not in league play. One suggestion for a small buff that would help alot but not overpower, would be a ROF increase for the HC. With a head-one pass, with the time spent making that tiny adjustment to aim, that the loopy for example doesnt have to do, i find i rarely get the time for that second, killing shot. My 2 cents. Thanks for the great game and support!
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#39
04-04-2010, 01:26 PM
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I noticed that HC biplanes now kill HA randas in two shots if they have a single veteran bar. This probably wasn't true before this patch. They also might be able to kill HA loopies in two shots if they have a veteran bar or two. I suggest those looking for ways to reincorporate biplane back into their play maybe try out using ace instincts or to prioritize their own safety more in play so that they spend more field time with veteran bars on.
Hopefully this might prove to make HC viable, or maybe not. Lam, if you'd like to give your thoughts on this, what other critical points does the HC buff change? Things like HC being able to three shot an HA bomber instead of four, etc?
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#40
04-04-2010, 07:04 PM
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You've already noticed the key critical points: HA Bomber (0 vet) and HA Miranda (1 vet). The other critical points are much less important in my opinion -- they typically moved the vet req a single level e.g. for Bomber from vet9+ace to vet8+ace:
HA Loopy (3 vet, or 2 with ace instincts) HA Explo (4 vet) Normal Biplane (6 vet) Normal Bomber (8 vet with ace instincts)
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