Heavy Armor is for noob biplanes

[[hlx] entr0py]

Dear Fellow Biplane Pilots,

Through an argument I had with this one fat guy I know, it has come to my attention that Heavy Armor is overused in ball. Heavy armor is an incredibly situational perk. Its main benefit is that it may let you penetrate a bit deeper and place the ball a bit further and perhaps even score a goal. It may be better than Flexible Wings when the enemy formation you are trying to penetrate has enough offensive power to destroy the flexy but not the heavy. However, I believe this situational benefit is not really worth using heavy over flexy, for most games.

If you are using HC, its hard to justify using Heavy Armor at all. HC is not for ball running. Its not impossible to do so, but the forward momentum you lose while firing makes it much harder to get distance compared to recoilless. Also, HC's strength in ball is eliminating dangerous planes quickly and occasionally wtfsniping ball runners and completely throwing off enemy pushes. Heavy Armor doesn't really complement this, while flexy helps aim much faster an deal with the loss of momentum.

If you are using recoilless, Heavy Armor's benefit becomes situational like I said before. Flexible Wings will continuously benefit a good biplane. The moment you leave the spawn and start to turn the benefit is already showing. The tighter turns allow you to get where you need to go faster. Sometimes this will help you stay alive by letting you maneuver through mines and walls or get cover. Flexy also lets you aim faster to kill and shoot the ball more accurately. Overall its effectively a continuous boost to speed, survivability, and offensive power -- assuming you know how to use it.

It comes down to a choice between continuous benefits from Flexible Wings or a situational benefit from Heavy Armor. I personally think a good biplane would be more effective using flexy to get yourself into a good position instead of using heavy and betting on the extra survivability making a difference.

<3,
entr0py

PS: Tristan is pretty bad at this game. Don't listen to him.

[DMCM]

Yes

For the most part Repair in any plane in ball is useless. The pace is too fast. You don't have time to heal and there's always plenty of deaths so plenty of health packs. Rubber Hull is even more useless of course. No serious player would even consider that perk. But anything besides flexi on biplane is an inferior choice for sure. Then again biplane is an inferior plane choice for ball anyway, even heavy cannon. If however you do choose to use it, you'll want to have the agility to turn faster not only for shooting other planes but also for passing/shooting the ball. Heavy armor won't help biplanes at all against the biggest threats in ball mode: emp/df loopies and thermos.

[wolf'j'max]

i did not read your post, and i will only respond to the title of this thread.
I has not approved.

[Kuja900]

biplane in ball is bad in general as dmcm said

[[hlx] entr0py]

I'm not trying to argue wether it is good or not for ball. I'm just comparing the effectiveness of the green perks.

[elxir]

lol biplane

[Boko]

Originally Posted by DMCM

Then again biplane is an inferior plane choice for ball anyway, even heavy cannon.

Originally Posted by Kuja900

biplane in ball is bad in general as dmcm said

Originally Posted by elxir

lol biplane

Unless you're Boko, or that other guy that I can't remember.

BWAHAHAHAHA

[XX1]

Originally Posted by [hlx] entr0py

I'm not trying to argue wether it is good or not for ball. I'm just comparing the effectiveness of the green perks.

hmmmmm

Heavy armor isnt a bad perk compared with other perks.
You point out that flexi helps you aim faster. Wrong, it makes your plane turn faster not necessarily aim better. With Heavy armor, you plane will turn slower but you have more time to actually get a good sight on the enemy and hit the plane. the difference is only about a second or less turning wise, which really isnt much.

In ball if a biplane is using HA they automatically becomes a tank in the playing field, the biplane already has better health than the loopy and miranda, adding HA gives it the most health out of any light plane while maintaining its small size. I do agree however that HC is not really good in ball unless you mainly plan on killing. Recoiless is generally better in ball

HA also is good at throwing people off. So many people are so used with biplanes using flexi that they underestimate its health when HA is used -> which can lead your victory during a dogfight.

but biplane is bad for ball in the first place

oh and Esoteric uses heavy armor

[hurripilot]

I'm pretty much obliged by my relationship with HA to reply to this thread, but after 2 years of trying to convince so many people that Biplane, and indeed HA biplane are awesome, I really don't have the energy required to tell you all how little you matter to anyone and how bad you are at life, so here :



I want you all to know that no matter how hard you try, and how many successes you may experience, your life will never be 1/1,000,000,000,000 as awesome as this picture.

Edit: I want to be really clear on this. I'm not talking about the Tomcat, or the pilot of the Tomcat, or the RIO, I'm just talking about the picture. That collection of pixels up there. You will never be worth anything in relation to those pixels up there. Now, forum admins, BAN AWAY!

[elxir]

that's a lot of dirt. i wonder if ajuk will dig it up and trade it for wood.

[Mt.Vesuvius]

I've got some wood for you...

[hurripilot]

Originally Posted by elxir

that's a lot of dirt. i wonder if ajuk will dig it up and trade it for wood.

u

F-14 TOMCAT

[Clapon]

HA on bip in ball seem semi less viable then flexi definitely on a HC, recoiless i guess its a matter of play style as i could see the benifits both ways. however the only bips i have any respect for in ball is entropy and homer, i havent talk much with ent bout strat or game sense so im not sure if he really knows what hes doing or if he just is doing it right.

But as stated earlier in this thread lol biplane.

While in TBD both have been proven quite good over time but for my self i like HA although i hardly play Bip.

[[hlx] entr0py]

Originally Posted by XX1

hmmmmm
You point out that flexi helps you aim faster. Wrong, it makes your plane turn faster not necessarily aim better. With Heavy armor, you plane will turn slower but you have more time to actually get a good sight on the enemy and hit the plane. the difference is only about a second or less turning wise, which really isnt much.

turn faster == aim faster === aim better

If you need more time make a good shot, you are playing way too slowly. When I miss, its because I aimed badly not because I didn't have enough time to aim. One second is huge in this game. Even 1/4 of a second can matter when you are shooting the ball or trying to kill someone.

[Ribilla]

No troll, rubber hull is underrated, it effectively allows you to ignore thermo, which can really fuq with a whale heavy team. I'm not saying it's the best perk, I'm saying it is unduly dismissed, simply because it HAS to be used by every single new player.

[classicallad]

No troll also, i love playing agaist 4 DF loopies out of 7 opponents, day in, day out.

[elxir]

Originally Posted by Ribilla

No troll, rubber hull is underrated, it effectively allows you to ignore thermo, which can really fuq with a whale heavy team. I'm not saying it's the best perk, I'm saying it is unduly dismissed, simply because it HAS to be used by every single new player.

yea it would be useful against whales except their shots do MORE damage to rubber hull

[Clapon]

Originally Posted by elxir

yea it would be useful against whales except their shots do MORE damage to rubber hull

lol yeah i was gonna say a heavy whale team will destroy a rubber hull, the ONLY use for rubber is if you cant fly, and if you cant fly then you shouldnt even be caring about balance talk so i think we can all keep rubber out of this convo.

[Duck Duck Pwn]

rubber's use is situational at best; you lose out on the benefits of one of more health or faster turning, as well as serving solely as a defense mechanism in terms of carrying the ball through chokes, and the occasional chance to have extra time to pass the ball after a collision with a wall. While this can be helpful on certain maps where there are many chokes (like funnelpark), especially considering that many whales rely on walls to get kills (and largely rightfully so), the added damage you take from each missile doesn't help things.

I disagree with the notion that it is useless and believe it can have some utility on some maps where there are many tight chokes where having that extra time or extra ability to not immediately die would be pretty helpful, like funnelpark, where virtually every path to the goal can be a choke of sorts

[Beagle]

Repair, heavy, and flexi are all great for Biplane for different reasons, which one is best for you depends on how you fly.

I don't know why this thread exists or why I'm posting in it

[[hlx] entr0py]

This thread is here because I am saying that flexy is the best green perk for biplane overall, while Heavy Armor may be better situationally. I did not mention the other two because they are no where near as effective. However, I will acknowledge bouncy is a lot better than most people admit. I occasionally use it on my loopy in ladder. When I played on bouncy servers, I could make shots with my HC that would normally get me killed. Repair on the biplane will get you killed befor

[JDR]

And if you don't use rev, it's all going to waste, regardless.

[Beagle]

I meant I don't know why someone decided to make a thread for no reason telling a bunch of strangers an idea that is not true

I believe the three green perks are all equally useful for different playstyles. I tend to drift between HA and Flexi in particular, but have also extensively used Repair. If you don't understand it yourself, I can try to explain further, or you can just trust me

[Boko]

In a discussion of balancing (which this is, once again) follow these secret guidelines (unless you wanna make moneyz *cough* WoW/LoL *cough*).

Boko's Balancing Guidelines:
1. Balance according to competitive play
2. Look at the highest skilled players in that setup when looking at certain setups
3. Make sure you review/discuss the balancing issue in different environments (in this case maps, team setups and relevant game modes)

Following these rules (and this is my perspective, correct me if you think I'm wrong on a certain point):
1. Flexi rules for bip in competitive play for all I know and that'll probably be for a reason
2. Anyone got an idea about highly skilled heavy armor/repair/rubberhull bip players? And if so, give proof (ladder matches, videos of leagues, extensive storiez).
3. I would not know the effect of the different green perks in different maps. Except that rubber is useful in thermo friendly maps, but this goes for all planes. Dunno how bipe is used in different team setups in TBD or ball. Flexi HC is most dominant in ball.

Looking at the currently gathered (or not --> point 2) information I would say that flexi (mostly HC) is the most popular. Something not being played much always has at least the following two potential reasons: underpowered or underrated. I've got a feeling they're both (with a bit more underratedness) for biplane.