Bomb ejection function. To pass the bomb.

[Vania]

I know I've talked about this before in other threads, but I think it needs a thread of its own.

Add a button to release the bomb without using it, so someone else can pick it up.


PROS:
-No need to suicide to pass the bomb.
-Encourage teamplay.
-Slow planes can pick up the bomb and pass it to better bombers.
-If you are stalled by an explodet you can pass the bomb to the guy coming behind you.
-New bombing strategies will arise. Plays, decoys, etc... that will bring more depth to the game.

CONS:
-I cant think of any, but maybe you can.


SPECIFICS:
Space bar would be a good option.
I think the bomb item should be ejected towards the back of the plane and up, so that it floats for a moment before dropping due to gravity.
The other items could be ejected too.


Please vote on this subject.
Yay or Nay ?

[DiogenesDog]

since you asked, here are some CONS:

- currently there's a huge reward for good teamwork in the carrying the bomb. this would reduce the penalty for being sloppy, which means that teamwork will have less of an effect.

- adding an extra button just for this one feature that isn't even in all game modes seems kind of hacky/ghetto / unnecessarily complicated. not a big deal, but meh.

- less strategy / teamwork necessary to select good bomb carriers and take up good positions in the map.

- change scares me

honestly tho it's not so much that I'm against it as that I don't care about it. I'm having trouble picturing whether it'd have an overall positive or negative effect, but overall I just can't bring myself to care enough to worry about it one way or the other.

[thatdarnedbob]

This would make it SO much easier to grief my team.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by DiogenesDog

- adding an extra button just for this one feature that isn't even in all game modes seems kind of hacky/ghetto / unnecessarily complicated.

Ok since i've thought about this a long ago i'll add my opinion.
First: why limiting this to the bomb? We could have a key binded to "drop whatever you got".
Second and (even if slightly off topic) more important: i never understood why can't we pick up the health pack like every other special (and use it when needed)?

[kirbmasta]

Originally Posted by Luke

Second and (even if slightly off topic) more important: i never understood why can't we pick up the health pack like every other special (and use it when needed)?

this would actually be really awesome to have, along with the ability to drop your item, people could act as medics

[Vania]

Yes, this same button could be used to drop any item you are carrying.

[ryebone]

Originally Posted by Vania

Yes, this same button could be used to drop any item you are carrying.

I dunno if it's just me, but personally I'd like to keep any powerup I have. Except the big bomb.

[Blind Pilot]

I totally like the idea, but I love being devil's advocate, so I'll think of a con or two...

1. Annoying people who demand that other people drop the bomb so they can have it because they "know what they're doing" and "the current holder of the big bomb R a total noob" etc.

2. Griefers/spies/traitors who will release the bomb near their own base so other team can pick it up and bomb (My red team sucks, someone from the blue team come get this bomb from me near the base)

3. Players who will refuse to take the bomb so they can play D or support only. Realistically, if this were in the game, I personally would ALWAYS want to pass the bomb to someone else. As it stands, I've been forced to make a few bombing runs and have actually learned a lot from doing so.


Not a complete list, and not the greatest, I'm sure... and I think passing the bomb is a great idea anyway.

[STACK]

Could be ok but the bomb would definitely have to go neutral once ejected. If it is ever implemented it should be a server option.

[Blank]

Originally Posted by Blind Pilot

I totally like the idea, but I love being devil's advocate, so I'll think of a con or two...

I like how everything in your list, people are capable of doing already.



All that said, I'm against this idea for 3 reasons:

1- Adds a new button
2- It's pointless except in ONE case (bomb tossing)
3- Gives more excuses for people not to 'escort' a bomb carrier in

At least Caped is man enough to toss that **** away ASAP for kills and admits as much.

[Vania]

Hmm. I agree it's main use would be for bombing in tbd.

But it still has some uses. For example:

-You want to grab an item but you already have another item. Instead of wasting the one you have you can release it for a teammate to pick up.

-You could play as an item collector, bringing items to your mates, making sure the defenders have shields and walls, etc...


Anyway, in the current state of the game, tbd is the most important game mode, and bombing is obviously a very important part of tbd.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by Blank

1- Adds a new button

You have more than 3 fingers, i think. And if you can't keep control of more than those 3 fingers at the same time, you could just ignore the new button.

Originally Posted by Blank

2- It's pointless except in ONE case (bomb tossing)

Why? If I have a shield and want to pick.. dunno.. a wall, instead of wasting the shield I could pass it to a teammate. If I have a health pack, would be great to pass it to an injured mate.

Originally Posted by Blank

3- Gives more excuses for people not to 'escort' a bomb carrier in

I can't see why.

[Blank]

Originally Posted by Luke

You have more than 3 fingers, i think. And if you can't keep control of more than those 3 fingers at the same time, you could just ignore the new button.

Why? If I have a shield and want to pick.. dunno.. a wall, instead of wasting the shield I could pass it to a teammate. If I have a health pack, would be great to pass it to an injured mate.

I can't see why.

1- You're adding a button that does NOTHING in FFA's and basically nothing in every other game mode except when it comes to the big bomb. That's moronic.

2- HOW ABOUT LETTING YOUR TEAMMATE PICK UP THE WALL, WOW AMAZING CONCEPT I KNOW. Health packs aren't even pickup/later use items.

3- It promotes this horrible idea that not everyone should be focused on bombing by being able to pass off a bomb. Just because a fatty has a bomb doesn't mean you're incapable of performing a bomb drop. Any ****ing plane can bomb, your escorts matter 95% more than what plane your in.

[Rechtschaffen]

Originally Posted by Blank

3- It promotes this horrible idea that not everyone should be focused on bombing by being able to pass off a bomb. Just because a fatty has a bomb doesn't mean you're incapable of performing a bomb drop. Any ****ing plane can bomb, your escorts matter 95% more than what plane your in.

It perverts the simplicity of the game to pass bombs about willy-nilly. The person with the bomb is the person who picks it up - and they should usually do so entirely on purpose. They will drop it when they die, which is why you have an escort.

[Nickname Here]

Pros-
-If a person with 3 gold bars accidently gets bomb he/she won't drop it to keep the gold bars (I've seen that a lot)

-If you could also use it on other items you could pass it to teammates in order to get a better weapon.

-If you add a team specifier so that only the team that drops the item can pick it up. (But if you're killed you drop nuetral item)

-If you suck at bombing and don't want to do it you can pass it to someone who is better adept to it.

-and instead of when ur in a tight situation and close to a wall and fire that clumbersom missle of yours that explodes on the wall right in front of you and kills you (yea, thats me) u can drop it instead.

-no more suicides for giving bombs

Cons-
-Extra button maybe to much to handle while in attacking or defending ...

-Whiners and complainers about the bomb and who shud take it

-May seduce teamwork by who would get to take bomb and nooblets who aren't that good but won't give up the bomb.

-may be over confident for skilled bombers and other people may thinking that escort is not required since that guy (the really good bomber) will always go and hit it. (not really if there is no escort)



I'm with the pro though.
I mean everything and even you has a pro and a con nobody is perfect
nobody is a pathetic ****head cause all of us have probably been there before but we've levelde up to 60 (there are still some people at that ****y level and im specificly talking about that darned bob )

[Luke]

Originally Posted by Blank

1- You're adding a button that does NOTHING in FFA's and basically nothing in every other game mode except when it comes to the big bomb. That's moronic.

You could drop-get an item-use it-get the first item back.
Anyway I really do not understand the problem about having a new button.

Originally Posted by Blank

Health packs aren't even pickup/later use items.

I was referring to a previous post when we talked about that possibility.

Originally Posted by Blank

3- It promotes this horrible idea that not everyone should be focused on bombing by being able to pass off a bomb.

I still can't get your point. I think that instead teamwork could be enhanced. The bomb carrier could drop the bomb and a team mate picks it up flying in a totally different direction.

[DiogenesDog]

On the teamwork point, it's basically just that it would be much more forgiving. You don't need super good coordination to keep the bomb alive, you just have to be flying in the general area as long as you're behind him.

it also hugely reduces the penalty for picking up the bomb with a slow plane... and making sure that good bomb carriers get the bomb is a sort of teamwork.

[Vi*]

I think passing things should be exclusive to the Planeball game mode, to keep it more unique. So yes, I think there shouldn't be passing of the bomb in Obj.

[Blind Pilot]

Originally Posted by Blank

I like how everything in your list, people are capable of doing already.

They can do it, but there's not a game mechanic to do so. They can't do it through passing the bomb, which is what this thread is about.


Arguing on the other side: Offense trumps defense in tba games. Passing the bomb would be another offensive tactic. And the game is fun as is.

[Blimey]

There are some days when you really just feel like defending the base, not going out on what is often for some a suicide mission, and when you accidently fly through the bomb and pick it up it really sucks that you then have to make the drop and be killed or suicide to pass it to a teammate.
Maybe a new button to let the bomb go without launching would work if there were higher penalties on it, e.g. it costs you energy to let it go, same as for mines, or the bomb becomes neutral, even if you'd previously taken it from your own base spawn point.
Or maybe it coul just be within a specified zone that you can let the bomb go, e.g. within a short radius of the spawn point near your base.
Of course, for this to work, the bomb would have to remain team-locked and not become available to the other team.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by Blimey

Or maybe it coul just be within a specified zone that you can let the bomb go, e.g. within a short radius of the spawn point near your base.

I disagree.. i think it would be funny deceiving the enemy.. they all fire at the carrier.. then he suddendly pass the bomb to a mate flying by who scores a hit.
It seems like there are more people against this change, tho.

[Vania]

There were some people supporting this change in other threads tho...
Where are you supportive people? Come and show your support!

I didnt think so many people would be against this change, but,
since it's such a simple change maybe Lamster could implement it as an optional feature you can turn off, so nobody loses.

I dont know, I'm just sick of being forced to crash when I want to pass the bomb.

[Triped]

I'd support it if it docked experience or bars or something and didn't add a new button. I guess that means I'm against it.

[nobodyhome]

Originally Posted by Vania

I dont know, I'm just sick of being forced to crash when I want to pass the bomb.

see that's the problem with your suggestion: the only real reason you'd want such a feature implemented is because you don't want to risk going for a bomb run when you accidently get the bomb. i.e. you're being caped without wanting to appear like a douche.

[Blind Pilot]

Originally Posted by nobodyhome

see that's the problem with your suggestion: the only real reason you'd want such a feature implemented is because you don't want to risk going for a bomb run when you accidently get the bomb. i.e. you're being caped without wanting to appear like a douche.

I understand your argument, but would counter that you are only partially right. There are some players who are very conscious of their own skill level (or lack thereof), and would rather that other, more skilled players take the bomb.

I wouldn't take the bombing run out of it though. Escorting the bomb carrier is important too, and everybody should do that, which means being ready to take over if the primary carrier gets downed.

In the end, it might be a question of, "do I want the developer to take the time to do this rather than something else?"

It's true that the game is great as is, but if it's going to be tweaked...

[Triped]

Originally Posted by Blind Pilot

I understand your argument, but would counter that you are only partially right. There are some players who are very conscious of their own skill level (or lack thereof), and would rather that other, more skilled players take the bomb.

Every role in TBD should be done by a skilled player. You want the best players intercepting an enemy bomber, protecting spawns, getting powerups, everything. It's all important to winning. Altitude doesn't need a feature just to help overly self-conscious players get over their disproportionate embarrassment about only one aspect of TBD.

[Vania]

see that's the problem with your suggestion: the only real reason you'd want such a feature implemented is because you don't want to risk going for a bomb run when you accidently get the bomb.

You totally missed the point...

I am a pretty good bomber and will do the bombing run if I can, but sometimes I want to pass the bomb to someone else, for example if my HP is really low.

It's all about teamwork, I dont want to be the bomber if I have like 1/2 HP and theres a mate with full health and better chances to succeed.

Did you read the first post where I explain all the possible uses of this?

[Luke]

First, I didn't think so many people would be against a new button, seems like after counting to 3 (S, D, F) their brain goes in overflow. Really, just ignore it. -_-'
Second, I can't see the problem with players who don't want to carry the bomb. It would surely be better if they could pass it instead of dropping it.

The code is already written (in obj you can toss the mine), so i suppose it could be implemented in no time.
I think it's quite hard to judge a new feature here on the forum, maybe it's worth a try in the next patch. Then if the feedbacks are negative, remove it.

[Golden Bough]

Originally Posted by Vania

...I am a pretty good bomber and will do the bombing run if I can, but sometimes I want to pass the bomb to someone else, for example if my HP is really low.

This is when you take one for the team and smash your plane into a wall, if, you are playing on a level that the bomb can be picked up on.

[nesnl]

Originally Posted by Golden Bough

This is when you take one for the team and smash your plane into a wall, if, you are playing on a level that the bomb can be picked up on.

I hate those levels where you can't pick up the bomb! The game seems to last forever!

But in all seriousness, I don't like this idea. We already deal with enough factors when dealing with bomb carriers that having this function would just cause more frustration and I highly doubt it would ever be used strategically. Just think about the 500 ping guy that you killed only to see the bomb "eject" out of no where on your screen 2 seconds after you kill him, but instead of being where you killed him, it's half a screen away... The situations where this is bad are endless... the situations where it is good are pretty limited.

[Blackjack]

Originally Posted by Vania

I know I've talked about this before in other threads, but I think it needs a thread of its own.

Add a button to release the bomb without using it, so someone else can pick it up.


PROS:
-No need to suicide to pass the bomb.
-Encourage teamplay.
-Slow planes can pick up the bomb and pass it to better bombers.
-If you are stalled by an explodet you can pass the bomb to the guy coming behind you.
-New bombing strategies will arise. Plays, decoys, etc... that will bring more depth to the game.

CONS:
-I cant think of any, but maybe you can.


SPECIFICS:
Space bar would be a good option.
I think the bomb item should be ejected towards the back of the plane and up, so that it floats for a moment before dropping due to gravity.
The other items could be ejected too.


Please vote on this subject.
Yay or Nay ?

B I agree and also it would be nice to be able to get the bomb and also be able to p/u other options to protect you rather than once you get the bomb thats all you can get.

[Nickname Here]

u cud probably make the new button e
with a simple reach up of the middle finger. you can eject the bomb. but there needs to be consequences like that person said earlier.

-you lose energy. probably you'd have to have more than 3/4 energy
-it becomes nuetral no matter what.
-you can't do it beyond a certain point like half of map or 3/4 of map.

[remulasce]

Idea:
The bomb is passable, but no one can pick it up for 1 sec (or whatever length of time) after it is passed. This way, people following the bomb are more involved, and more people get a chance to get the bomb, not just the five people who first try attacking. It would make advances take longer (1+ sec per pass) so both defenders and attackers can get more organized, so when the bomb finally hits, it's because of a well organized effort, with perhaps multiple bomb carriers.

Plus all the other pros.

[wolf'j'max]

This is what u said blank
1- You're adding a button that does NOTHING in FFA's and basically nothing in every other game mode except when it comes to the big bomb.

Not agreed like we said u can use it to throw away ur item fast and take another instead of using it and waste the item u want because it took too long

Vania i think its and great idea to make a button just to drop ur item

Cya wolf

[classicallad]

Wolfy, i like the new depth that this option could offer but perhaps this could better suit a specialized enviroment.. for example

Reeslo's map {green}, you in effect have a game of football in planes!!

I think introducing this concept as standard for tbd's might cause a split in opinion for the certainly the hardcore Altitude community out there, obviously noobs won't know any different but i definately think your idea has potential but in a specific specialized enviroment.

I would suggest the key be the 'G' key as for most of us the natural wavering position of the index finger favours that position and could be easily pressed without distraction from the main keys. [This is based on a new mac keyboard].

I think that the Altitude designers and editors would do well to discuss this one

[as red as black]

I'm fine without bomb passing. I'll probably be fine with bomb passing though I'm kinda against because I would never use it and I'm for bombing runs being challenging.

I wouldn't want to see it in official servers, but I'd be fine if it was a server option.

So pretty much, I think it's a waste of time. Doesn't matter. Things concerning bombing runs are pretty perfect and don't need to be changed. Except, I think bomb hits should be worth 50xp. but that's another topic....

[Fatknacker]

Originally Posted by classicallad

Reeslo's map {green}, you in effect have a game of football in planes!!

That would be awesome (can you tell I’m going through football withdrawals until the new season starts )
Even though we ‘aint got Reeslo’s maps anymore!

[snaad]

on the queation: yay or nay: YAY

[wolf'j'max]

Originally Posted by snaad

on the queation: yay or nay: YAY

Yay ere again vania