SL8 Week 3

[darknietzsche]

Week 3: Sunday 30th June 2013, 2PM EDT/6PM GMT

http://images.challonge.com/SL8.png

Map pool:
Round 5: snow, ice, funnelpark, darkwar, maze
Round 6: cave, grotto, core, labyrinth, mayhem2
Round 7: asteroids, planepark, lost city, cross, hardcourt


Servers: Bottom team chooses server and starts veto. Away teams may switch servers after game 1 or 2, but have 60 seconds to do so, both teams have 5 minutes to have picked a map and have teams ready****
****Note: Servers chosen must be stable and is the responsibility of the server owner to ensure server stability. Also note, a ladder admin must be present to use the ladder servers if not available you must choose a different server.
Format: Bo3

[darknietzsche]

Can team captains tell me if they prefer to make the regular season 2 or 1 more week? Majority wins, if draw I will do two weeks. If two weeks, rounds 5 and 6 will be played this week followed by round 7 next week. If one week all three rounds played this weekend with playoffs starting next weekend.

[Threevenge]

It needs to be all this weekend. Trying to play 4th of July weekend is probably a bad idea.

[Clapon]

play all three this week

[sunshineduck]

just do 3 this week, 1 wk break for america day, then playoffs after

[angryirishman0]

TADOW is also in favor of ensuring Bizarro TADOW has yet another flawless season a week early

[lakospeter91]

Members of {arr} would prefer those 3 matches spread out to 2 weekends.

[BrazNomar]

Although most answers I gathered were to the "I guess it's not too much of a problem" side, ZeroG members agree on a single 3-match Sunday.

[blln4lyf]

3 week season? Why is it so short this go around?

[darknietzsche]

Well, next weekend I assume is going to be hard for americans to show, so I would rather have a 3 week regular season and skip a week for playoffs rather than a 5 week regular season because half the teams cant show next week.

We will do three this week, if you guys cant play all 3, you will complete them sometime between now and the next two weekends.

[lakospeter91]

Sounds good.

[JWhatever]

Vlix 2-1 ZeroG
Vlix 2-1 arr
Vlix 2-0 Tadow

-J

[Xorg]

SMILE 2-1 Tadow
SMILE 1-2 ball
SMILE 0-2 r87

ggs

[sunshineduck]

r87 > arr 2-0
r87 > tadow 2-1
r87 > [x malta x] 2-0

ggs

[lakospeter91]

r87 - arr 2 - 0
arr - VLIX 1 - 2
arr - BBQ 0 - 2

[DICK van DYKE]

bbq
0-2 ball
2-1 zrog
2-0 arr

[Carlos98]

ball v bbq 2-0
ball v smile 2-1
ball v zrog 2-0

[angryirishman0]

TADOW 1 - 2 Smile
TADOW 1 - 2 R87
TADOW 0 - 2 Vlix

[VAN1SH1NG]

Let me know if you notice any issues with the vids as I will need to delete the fraps recordings soon to free hard drive space. Missing a total of 3 goals from the first games in round 5 and the fps drops for a couple minutes during round 7 Smile vs r87 game 2, but think everything else should be good.

Round 5
arr vs R87
BBQ vs Ball
Vlix vs ZroG
Smile vs Tadow

Round 6
r87 vs Tadow
Vlix vs arr
ZroG vs BBQ
Ball vs Smile

Round 7
Tadow vs Vlix
BBQ vs arr
Ball vs ZroG
Smile vs r87

[JWhatever]

Originally Posted by VAN1SH1NG

Let me know if you notice any issues with the vids as I will need to delete the fraps recordings soon to free hard drive space. Missing a total of 3 goals from the first games in round 5 and the fps drops for a couple minutes during round 7 Smile vs r87 game 2, but think everything else should be good.

Round 5
arr vs R87
BBQ vs Ball
Vlix vs ZroG
Smile vs Tadow

Round 6
r87 vs Tadow
Vlix vs arr
ZroG vs BBQ
Ball vs Smile

Round 7
Tadow vs Vlix
BBQ vs arr
Ball vs ZroG
Smile vs r87

There was some rubber banding in one of the vlix videos, can't remember which one. Could be network related tho and it isn't a major issue.

Great uploads once again, tyvm.

-J

[darknietzsche]

So after being very consumed about tie breakers for the top 3 teams:

Tiebreakers:

Head to head
All 3 teams were 1-1 against each other.

2nd Tiebreaker Total goals for in the games between top 3 teams:

1) BBQ=20
1)Vlix=20
3)Ball=17

3rd Tiebreaker Total goals scored against during the entire season:

1) BBQ = 36
2) Vlix = 41
3) Ball = 62

So BBQ will be 1 seed, vlix 2 seed and ball 3 seed.

[darknietzsche]

Based on some chat logs I received, I am reversing the TADOW vs SMILE match giving TADOW a 2-0 victory over smile for timing constraints and general stalling that was going on during their match. 20 mins especially after the first game is too long and understanding of the rules could have cleared up the situation much sooner. Also, the fact that smile was trying to play with an unregistered player (eventhough in the end they didnt) is undermining of the rules and considered a general stalling tactic. Also trying to distract opponent by spamming pms and friend invites during a game is generally frowned upon, whether it was one or five players doing it. This being said this ruling affects Tadows and SMILE seeding in the playoffs.

Smile ends with 2 points instead of 5 and Tadow will end with 4 instead of 2 switching them from 7th to 8th and vice versa.

If Smile wants to appeal this decision the captain needs to put together a case that they were not generally trying to stall their games since it was only 5v5 and that no one was spamming their opponents with messages to distract them. I will take any appeals up to July 10th.

[Threevenge]

Originally Posted by darknietzsche

So after being very consumed about tie breakers for the top 3 teams:

Tiebreakers:

Head to head
All 3 teams were 1-1 against each other.

2nd Tiebreaker Total goals for in the games between top 3 teams:

1) BBQ=20
1)Vlix=20
3)Ball=17

3rd Tiebreaker Total goals scored against during the entire season:

1) BBQ = 36
2) Vlix = 41
3) Ball = 62

So BBQ will be 1 seed, vlix 2 seed and ball 3 seed.

Fair ruling.

[Xorg]

Okay, since that 'chaos' is posted in forums, let make this clear. In the beginning we had 4 people. Yes, Tadow had to wait for our 5th guy for 5 minutes. I warned Noval and Irish about having attendance problems. Irish said: 'k no problem'. After our 5th player showed up, everything was set. Partly, the reason of that chaos is Evilarsenal. Last Sunday he smoked weed. Although it's his problem, but his gameplay affected on our team. He was playing with us 1st game and we lost that ice game with score 6-5. We wouldn't have made tadow wait for 20 minutes if I reveal some details, which were happening during those 20 minutes. Why would we distract tadow members, spamming PMs? We would NEVER spam tadow members to distract someone. The only guy who I talked about that situation was its captain Irish. Why would we play with an 'unregistered player'? The guy who tried to play with us is Jonus. As soon as he was invited to play with us, I posted about his registration in SL registration thread. Yes, I did this too late, but let me remind you our game vs ZroG. In Week 1, ZroG had 5 people before 2nd game. It didn't take them too long, we weren't complaning just like CryingIrish did last Sunday. ZroG didn't want to play with us 5vs5(5vs6) and it took us 5 minutes to wait. So, they recruited Tjerki and para. But they updated roster after Week 1. After I got a word from Irish, that we'll get forfeited if we play with Jonus, I deleted that post and he didn't play with us these 2 games. We played 5vs5. By the way irish, about that situation. As far as your players are concerned, some of your players made us wait as well, despite that we were ready as 6vs6. Before playing 5vs5 we tried to have 6vs6(with evil). Despite that I tried to calm you down Irish, instead of making solutoins you kept crying about fortreit as the result we both waited for each other for 20 minutes. And after finally solving this problem out, we decided to play 5vs5 and everything went well. Between 3rd game we had no problems at all and as the result we won with score 2-1 which is overall. And one more question: Why are we going to end this regular season with 2 points? We weren't trying to make games stable aganist ball and r87. We had no problems at all against ball and r87. We haven't made them wait for too long because our 6th guy(Alnilam) showed up after the game vs tadow. It was only about us and tadow.

DN, was it Irish who contacted you about that problem? I'd like to see what he thinks about this situation.

[darknietzsche]

First off, Tadow actually sent me a pm after I posted that and further said that the spamming was not as bad and in fact you were mainly just apologizing (which is perfectly ok actually), but that is not why I added the decision. I am sorry I accused you guys of that. First off, it was several Tadow players who talked to me during and after the situation had happened, so attacking a certain player in the forums is unprofessional and I had hoped you guys would take to pming me like Tadow had, but I needed to say that I had decided on this otherwise no one have known. I agree that in the end you did not do anything wrong with regards to unregistered players, but you spent 20 mins arguing whether if he could play or not, when if you had just asked me I would have likely said he would be alright to play especially since you only had 5. I only find it a general stalling tactic because it was the opponents you had who contacted me about this issue not your team.

In the end, I probably can reverse the decision if you and Tadow agree that this in the end was not a big issue, but I did receive a lot of complaints to say the least about the situation. With regards to evil, you should be able to control your players and deal with them. If you thought it would have been a problem to continue, you may have asked to just post pone your game or have me come arbitrate.

I suggest you talk to Tadows captains about the issue and see if you can solve this internally. If you can, I would be happy to reverse the decision. As of now with the chat logs I have, it definitely seems that you guys tried to stall in the first two games. If you have proof Tadow did similar things you can send them to me via PM.

[darknietzsche]

After reviewing some more chat logs, I am going to reverse the decision again. The original results will hold. I feel that both teams are sort of at fault. Tadow if they wanted to take the forfeit easily could have, but no team wants to do that. With regards to the time delays, it is completely unacceptable, but it seems it was mainly due to one player in particular on smile and again Tadow had the chance to take a forfeit (and if they did not think they could not have, talking to me would have been best). I have told them to deal with this accordingly within their team and that playoffs will not be acceptable for this and that if they do this again it will result in a forfeit. I suggest both teams take on arbitration next time they come into conflict. I was only pmed once during this situation about one minor issue in the end. I feel Tadow has a right to be upset about the waiting. I would say the rules saying 15 mins is actually too long and teams should not have to wait more than 10 mins (which to me is still being extremely generous). It seems from the chatlogs as well that Smiles players at least the captains was sincere and apologetic.

In the end,
Tadow not taking action during the game and the fact that it seems silly to penalize a team for one players stupidity is harsh and unreasonable, but in the future, this type of event without contacting me will be met with a removal from the tournament since it will be playoffs.

Please respect every team and member even if they are someone on your own team. If you don't like someone it is best just not to say anything to them.

[angryirishman0]

I'm not going to participate in Xorg's namecalling; he should know how he acted wasn't appropriate. We tried very hard to give them the benefit of the doubt but after the fact our overall sentiment is they were being intentionally disruptive. If you want to re-reverse the decision DN that's fine, we just really wanted to play rather than taking a forfeit. However, given the way they've acted not only this SL but last SL towards us (when they did heavily abuse friending and pm'ing during our match), they've burned up our goodwill and from now on we're going to automatically move to have a forfeit or whatever appropriate action declared against them if they're in any way stepping out the rules. They're the only participating clan who has problems like this in our experience and frankly I'm very tired of dealing with Smile so we'll just have to immediately report anything we feel should be reported and let an arbitrator handle it then. That should avoid this situation we find ourselves in now.

Also without getting too much into his post's inaccuracies, Xorg blaming his lack of leadership on one of his players smoking weed is probably one of the stupidest excuses he could have given. I hope they manage to get themselves together for SL playoffs

edit:
To be clear, we're not taking issue with the scores of a 5v5 game. We take issue with their inability to respond to simple questions repeatedly when we are trying to get a game started (flat out ignoring us) and then later whining and trying to force the start of a game when we point out the rules that you cannot have an unregistered player on the team to which we were given a ton of attitude. If they, as Lenny said, are unfamiliar with the rules - then they better go back and read them. They've been in enough SL's that I don't take that as a very valid excuse. We didn't have anything to do with whatever happened between them and ZroG, and if Smile is unable to follow the simple guidelines then I don't think future matches against them without issue will be feasible. Lenny spoke with me briefly while trying to set up the 2nd and 3rd games and there were no problems with him (if he was co-capt though he could have spoken up when we were begging for an answer from them in the lobby), but most other members of smile had a piss-poor attitude and having to deal with them again at any point in my life will be too soon. I feel we were more than generous and patient regarding their "confusion" over the unregistered player when they were at times unable to hold a normal conversation with us about it yet we erroneously stuck around for them to get themselves together. I stand by my previous statements that I felt it was intentional on Xorg's part, or extreme incompetence, or a combination of the two.

I was going to let the whole thing go because who wants to deal with this, but since we are airing grievances - whatever may come of the match decision - this is us going on record that we won't be tolerating any of Smile's shenanigans anymore.

[Lenny']

Originally Posted by darknietzsche

After reviewing some more chat logs, I am going to reverse the decision again. The original results will hold. I feel that both teams are sort of at fault. Tadow if they wanted to take the forfeit easily could have, but no team wants to do that. With regards to the time delays, it is completely unacceptable, but it seems it was mainly due to one player in particular on smile and again Tadow had the chance to take a forfeit (and if they did not think they could not have, talking to me would have been best). I have told them to deal with this accordingly within their team and that playoffs will not be acceptable for this and that if they do this again it will result in a forfeit. I suggest both teams take on arbitration next time they come into conflict. I was only pmed once during this situation about one minor issue in the end. I feel Tadow has a right to be upset about the waiting. I would say the rules saying 15 mins is actually too long and teams should not have to wait more than 10 mins (which to me is still being extremely generous). It seems from the chatlogs as well that Smiles players at least the captains was sincere and apologetic.

Well of course i like this decision. As Smile's co-captain I'd like to say some words to this as well:
As Xorg already said we had some internal problems(which caused some time sadly), and it was our fault we that we registered that player too late. We didnt know exactly what the rules said and that caused some extra time. But Imo Tadow couldv been a little more generous concerning that fact, we also accepted Zrogs fast recruiting of tjerk and para.
About the "spamming pm" i think everything is said, the pms (i and xorg sent some)were more of aplogetic content than with any intention to spam.
We asked Tadow if they would play us 5v5, they couldv said no and win by forfeit easily, yet they didnt.
Concluding:
Internal Problems of Smile }
Not enough knowledge about the rules} Our Fault

Tadow could have easily won us by forfeit because its obvious were having attendance problems. During the game, they did not say so and afterwards(after they lost) they complain about our faults which they more or less "accepted" during the game.
DN i can live with any decision you make.
Lenny

[Kafka]

Originally Posted by Xorg

the reason of that chaos is Evilarsenal. Last Sunday he smoked weed. Although it's his problem, but his gameplay affected on our team.

Originally Posted by darknietzsche

With regards to evil, you should be able to control your players and deal with them.

Originally Posted by angryirishman0

Also without getting too much into his post's inaccuracies, Xorg blaming his lack of leadership on one of his players smoking weed is probably one of the stupidest excuses he could have given.

GOD FORBID someone toke up while playing an online game. What is this, Reefer Madness all over again? You could all use a bowl, lighten up, and stop b*tching about meaningless quarrels in a cartoon plane game.

[Slender]

Useless fact: Evil is smoking weed or some sort of smoking product every 2 minutes of his life. So some times he might be all slow and stuff or just pure hype.

[Xorg]

Originally Posted by angryirishman0

Also without getting too much into his post's inaccuracies, Xorg blaming his lack of leadership on one of his players smoking weed is probably one of the stupidest excuses he could have given. I hope they manage to get themselves together for SL playoffs

I just lol'd at this one. I'm sure if you had evil in your team, you would have the same 'excuse'. I'll have to agree to what Slender said:

Originally Posted by SlenderMan

Useless fact: Evil is smoking weed or some sort of smoking product every 2 minutes of his life. So some times he might be all slow and stuff or just pure hype.

[angryirishman0]

Originally Posted by Xorg

I just lol'd at this one. I'm sure if you had evil in your team, you would have the same 'excuse'. I'll have to agree to what Slender said:

I think you're missing the point. What I'm saying is 'who cares?', so don't use that as an excuse for your team issues.

[evilarsenal]

Originally Posted by Xorg

I just lol'd at this one. I'm sure if you had evil in your team, you would have the same 'excuse'. I'll have to agree to what Slender said:

actually xorg, go **** yourself, i literally said a girl was trying to have sex with me... when you sub me after 36 minutes of straight bull****, im not gonna be playing a video game when a girl is raping me

**** you

[Knipchip]

Why play ball at all? Wake up and l2p already.

On-topic: Xorg is by far the saddest of you.

[Threevenge]

Can we try to keep all this drama to PMs or better yet, just play? DN really shouldn't have to deal with it; this is partially why he is trying to get out of organizing our leagues. Can't blame him at all.